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Loxone Config 9

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  • Loxone Config 9

    Apparently they started teasing Loxone Config 9:

    There are some partial screenshots that look quite ok. The overview blocks look nice, but it will depend how well the combine with non-Loxone things... So, anyone know which things we might gain... or loose?


  • #2
    Hi Jörg,

    Loxone started a public beta phase for the Config 9 and the App 8 a few weeks ago - at least in the german speaking countries:
    As far as I have tested both Config as App there are some benefits but also some things they made worse by destroying the intuitive control of the app.
    The new block theme has some orientation towards Win10 whereas the older Apps rather orientate towards iOS or Android (flat theme, much white or black)...
    At first the overview ist really bad you have to get used to the look and the way the app arranges the blocks and as Loxone uses serveral layers for each block you have to tap on almost each function before you have the buttons you are looking for...
    But maybe you could find your own opinion by testing it ;-)
    Zuletzt geändert von Benjamin Jobst; 30.Aug.2017, 12:18.
    MfG Benny


    • #3
      It just happened to appear on my facebook timeline. I'm currently away from home (for more than a year) but was planning to redo my entire config in the mean tine (current one was started in Config 6, a bit adapted to 7, but in general it became messy - also because I was learning it still). Now I have a better idea on how to do it, so I thought of starting over using what I learned from the previous config. I just had installed Config 8, but seeing as they will launch 9 in the end of September I will hold off for now. I was holding config 8 due to some older Android devices not being able to run the app, but they are gone now.

      I won't have that much time in the next couple of weeks, so I might as well skip the beta. I mainly use Loxone as a front-end for my knx/squeezebox/htpc systems, so interaction with external devices is key... I hope not too much was altered in that department, and I probably should assume those overview blocks may be more Loxone-only... but I'll see when it comes out.
      Thanks for the reply!


      • #4
        Alright then you may have to learn a few new things Loxone has changed in the meanwhile betwen v7 and v9. But actually the basics still are quite the same.
        The KNX-functions have not changed a thing - which could be interpreted as good and as bad equally facing other restrictions Loxone made to Modbus/TCP.
        When your time is limited I would recommend you wait for the release version of Config 9 as this should be a better and (hopefully) more stable base for a real environment.
        The communication of Loxone with external systems is a critical point still but it should work nevertheless.
        If you could use the overview-central-blocks depends on the basic blocks you are using. With the EIB-KNX-blocks I have no experience so far if they also can be integrated but I frankly doubt it, yes.
        I think it would be best if you just put a safe, working version of your system aside as backup in case there are functions which will not work with the new config. This way you can roam through the new config to find out the changes...
        MfG Benny


        • HBeumer
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          Are there additional restrictions to Modbus/TCP with Loxone v9 when compared to Loxone v8? or are these the same?

      • #5
        Yes... Also I would hope the documentation will be more up-to-date once v9 is officially released.

        I managed to implement some tricks to make e.g. the intelligent room controller work together with my knx thermostat (they synchronize operation modes, loxone could read the current and the set temperature but I had a problem with the number format for setting the temperature from the loxone) and last I was trying to get the lighting controller block to work with the knx lights. I also managed relay media information using Eventghost on my pc and http inputs on the loxone side, but this could not integrate with the loxone-specific mediacontroller block (and I suspect that will still be the case :-)). All of this was quite basic, I suspect that what worked will all still work.

        For sure it is best to keep a backup, but that is just a matter of opening my current config in Config 9 and saving it back. But I feel I need to start from scratch, as it is just too much to start messing in an existing config.

        I hope the new Config allows for some sort of template or better copy/paste function: in all my rooms I have similar lights, thermostat and media, but I ended up making it all manually for each room... :-)


        • #6
          If you proceed in the right order you could create a big part of your home with an integrated function starting from scratch - at least what concerns the loxone-basic functions for lighting, shades and heating.
          You just have to set up your hardware at first definig all inputs and outputs with category and room as well as setting all rooms and categories you want to use.
          Then the wizard takes this information and creats one sheet per room and in each room places the corresponding functions as well as the input and output flags. Additionally the wizard creats central functions.
          When using KNX to me this is not a basic Loxone function any more as you have to use loads of workarounds to make KNX working with the Loxone standard "intelligent" blocks. These workarounds will of course not be prepared by the wizard but this can be added with the copy & paste witout problems - assuming you do not want to copy any I/O or other flags with them as this will not work at all.
          Maybe you could give me a hint with your intelligent room controller workaround as we are steadily working on the Loxone-KNX-integration and our workarounds so fare offer either a Operation Mode usage OR a current/set temperature integration. Both have not been working so far... Maybe you did find a better solution then I have been able to so far =)
          MfG Benny


          • #7
            For that wizard to work, do you need to be connected to the miniserver? Or is it possible to run that without the miniserver present? Because I'm away from home and unable to connect to the miniserver for this purpose...


            As for the knx-loxone connection, here is the thread
            It does not contain the full solution though, I can send you the info of my config, but am not able to do that soon. But to summarize what I did (my knx thermostats are Gira Pushbuttonsensors). In the loxone config, I defined operating modes that match the operating modes of the Gira (with name and temperature). In the loxone config I added a radio button to select the operating mode, and I gave it those operating modes. When the radio button selects an operating mode, it is passed on to the Gira and vice versa. This was a bit tricky, as I needed to determine which of the two modes actually changed (particularly if I allow changes via a global button or timers in the gira thermostat). Here, I used a memory flag to hold the current value and use that one to verify if either the gira operating mode was changed or if the loxone operating mode was changed; from that I could update the other one. This was quite a complicated layout, with a lot of IF blocks - I still think it should be possible to make it more elegant. As the loxone mode is reflected in the intelligent room controller, it also matches with the currently set operating mode. I did not fully complete it, but I think timers in the intelligent room controller also worked.

            The current temperature can be read from the gira thermostat, so I can feed that one to the intelligent room controller.

            I was struggling with the translation of the knx datatype used for the temperature in the thermostat, so while I was successful in reading the temperature (both current and setpoint temperature) from the knx bus, I did not manage to send a value from the Loxone to the knx bus. Something always went wrong with the interpretation of the datatype (as mentioned in the thread I posted). It may be solvable by changing the type in the ETS config, but I don't know ETS. I also prefer my ETS config to work without the loxone, so that it serves as a backup in case the loxone fails (ETS was programmed by an installer). This is why I use the timers of the knx thermostats. Ideally, I would love to set up the loxone so that it can override the knx system, but without the loxone that it would fall back to the behaviour as defined in knx.

            Hope this helps...


            • #8
              No, the wizard just works inside the Config itself, you don't need any Miniserver connected. Just have a try, I think for the basic configuration it works quite well =)
              I'll have a look at your KNX-temp-strategy, maybe I can find some new hints thanks a lot ;-)
              MfG Benny


              • #9
                Is the wizard this "auto configuration"? When I try that (in Loxone 8), it says I need to specify room and type for the peripherals. I have no Loxone peripherals, and the auto configure does not seem to take into account knx things or virtual input/outputs. As a test, when I add something on the input/output of the miniserver, it does generate pages accordingly. So I guess the wizard will not help me...


                • #10
                  Oh, I was sure it also did work with KNX components last time I tested it... but that's not 100%. If that's true I'm sorry...
                  Yes, I did mean the auto configuration, as I said when you have configured the rooms, categories and the corresponding I/Os I was sure it did work with KNX as well as EnOcean and Loxone I/Os...
                  MfG Benny


                  • #11
                    I just did a quick test, where I put a KNX actuator block and assigned it room and category and then ran the autoconfiguration, which just gave the error message. I then created a config that had a single miniserver input, assigned things and tried again; this worked. But maybe there is more to it than just a single knx block. For sure it will be something I will experiment with in Config 9, before setting off to make my config again: if it works it could save me a lot of time. If that does not work, I hope there are better functionalities for copying between configs (I could make the pages ones and copy them), I always found that a bit confusing in 7.
                    Now I am bit traveling around for work, but by the time I get back I should be able to start. :-)


                    • #12
                      I checked again in Config 8, and KNX buttons do not seem to work with the auto config... Guess I'll have to keep what I have.

                      I opened my config regarding the synchronization between the knx operation mode and the loxone operation mode. To keep them synchronized, you need to figure out which one changed and then do the correct actions. I don't know how to export the diagram (and it is a mess of line), but the concept is as follows:

                      First, I have a memory flag M that holds the current operation mode (in the situation where the loxone operation mode L = knx operation mode K). There a radio button where the outputs activate Loxone operation modes and the output AQ is the value I use in the logic to identify the loxone operation mode L. The analogue input of the radio button is connected to M, via an analogue memory that has the start pulse as trigger (this is to initialize correctly). I use similar values to the AQ outputs to identify the KNX modes.

                      Now, the logic is that if K<>L, then one of them changed. Using M, we know that it is the one that differs from M that changed, so the one that is equal to M is the one we need to modify (and then modify M). This gives:
                      if K<>L and K=M then K=L (this sets the memory flag that will set the operation mode in knx)
                      if K<>L and L=M then L=K (this is done by feeding L to the the Als of the radio button)
                      if K==L then M=K (this will set the memory flag M to match the current settings)

                      With this system, if timers are set in the knx system, they will modify and the loxone will show the result. The radio button shows the correct operatingmode and works to change the operation mode from the knx thermostats using the loxone. I don't remember if the loxone timer in the intelligent room controller causes updates in the knx system (I don't think that worked).

                      Hope this story makes sense. I have thermostats for each room, and actually made specific modes in the Loxone for each room. Last thing I worked on was a global mode/override to allow a fast setting of all the rooms (and I was also thinking of e.g. set a holiday timer that forces all the rooms on a specific mode until the timer runs out).
                      Zuletzt geändert von J V; 05.Sep.2017, 20:29.